The Real SharePoint Knights - SharePoint Joel's SharePoint Land

Comments

I have seen your work...

...and have benefited from the free exchange of knowledge from the Knowing to the Unknowing.

You welcome strangers into your midst and treat them as family.

Thank you, SharePoint Knights.

Joy the Unknowing

at 5/4/2009 7:05 PM

SharePoint MVP - can of worms

I think you may have opened a can of worms here Joel! Being really blunt..."it's much more behind the scenes"....what is wrong with the MVP program and how is it inferior to what you propose here? MVP is more than just "promoting your skills"...I'm with Bob on this...most MVP's that are awarded are for: helping on forums, presenting at Microsoft events, helping at user group, assisting on open source stuff, whitepapers ... I don't see many SharePoint MVPs who actually get through purely on technical (skill) merit whatsoever! Plus MVP gives you NDA'd information on new releases...I believe also some cash for MVP meetup every year...plus licensing help...how is it "much more"? NOTE: I'm not an MVP.

at 5/4/2009 7:38 PM

A fellow knight

What I like about the SharePoint Knight program is that it is voted on by those in the community and at least at this point there doesn't seem to be any politics involved. Do you love what you do? Do you love to help people? It's nice to be recognized for the things I do even though I may never be an MVP.

at 5/4/2009 7:52 PM

Interesting idea

Maybe the thought is that the MVP program is a bit limited and sometimes almost political in who it can and can't accept based on the fact it is under the Microsoft banner.

Was wondering would you have codeplex initiatives down for earning points, there is some great work being done in the SharePoint space there by a few that don't recieve much recognition.

Also being a "community" does that mean that there is an idea of getting voted in perhaps i.e. the community has a role in deciding what is worthy.
I'm interested in hearing who for example will make the judgement call on whether something like doing x usergroup presentations counts if they are all just sales pitches about a product you are selling or x number of newgroups replys which were all copy and paste from google.

at 5/4/2009 8:03 PM

You must be freaking kidding me

I'm Speechless. Not very clear where you are going with this. I think you are upset about not being awarded MVP

at 5/4/2009 9:43 PM

Got a point

I think I know where you are coming with this. I don't think you are upset about not being MVP. You and others do heaps for the community, but are no where close to getting an MVP... As for others, they do few SharePoint presentations, release web part or two, 'network' in the right place and there you go -MVP. One of them has rightly said that new MVPs (not renewals) do manage to lobby hard to get the status. Can certainly relate to this... even without blogging, answering questions on news forums, you can still be an MVP.... by lobbying...

at 5/4/2009 11:12 PM

You Rock

Don't listen to the doom sayers. This is a fantastic idea - for the people by the people. It will in no way detract from the elitist MVP's who in my experience have over-inflated egos. Go for it!!

at 5/5/2009 1:34 AM

erm, why points for certification?

MCTS & MCM etc - as these have nothing to do with community per se, but rather technical competency

at 5/5/2009 1:46 AM

Interesting Idea

Interesting idea. I think there is a big difference between doing things for the community and doing what is in your job description. There are a lot of people who do what they can in the community and expect nothing in return MVP or knight. Give what you can and you will get what you need in return.

Community people, that is what its all about.

JGH

at 5/5/2009 4:26 AM

The Jedi Knights

I don't disagree with what you're doing, but a point system wasn't what I had in mind for the #SPBabes Knights. I've been pretty vocal regarding the requirements for the MVP program and have heard there are going to be changes regarding who qualifies which I think needs to happen. I respect people with or without that distinction and to me the title or cert is just metadata for the human being. If people want to call it a popularity contest, that's one perspective but to me, these are just ways to help the community group themselves together so there isn't so much noise. It's what I did with #SPBabes - women bond differently than men do and I wanted to make sure that I was following the women in the community. It's seems a shame to me that we can't all coexist and that MVP's feel that this in some way is a dig on them. It's natural that as communities get larger, we feel safer in smaller groups. Good luck with this, Joel.

at 5/5/2009 5:53 AM

SharePointJoel, aka SharePointJoke

"I swear to upload the code with honor"
-> what does this even mean?

"I will not say I'm busy when a brother or sister is in need technical or otherwise if I am able or refer to another"
-> Isn't this just being a nice guy? Is this something that you really want to call out?

"I will not put company or other politics above the community or knights"
-> Typically the "company" is what is paying your bills and allowing you time to travel to these shows and events. I am not going to jack my company man.

"I will not violate Microsoft NDA"
-> Classic, so you promise to follow contracts you have signed. You are beyond reproach!

"I will be honest with technology in how I share it on my blog and various social networks"
-> What is 'honest with technology'?

I will not use the Knighthood to put down another
-> 3rd grade..ok that was harsh, 4th grade.

I will share my knowledge in newsgroups, blogs, conferences, SharePoint Saturdays, code camps, and user groups
-> So how is this any different that all of the MVPs are most others that aspire to be 'active' in the community. Seems like a very low bar, just what is needed here, thanks for adding.

I will not be evil. I will promote positive SharePoint Knights in upholding chivalrous practices in helping those in need and providing service to the community
-> How about you add 'I will not kill other SharePoint people unless they do harm to another SharePoint Knight', geez dude, you are hard core; I can't be a little evil?

I will do what I can to give more than I get from fellow Knights
-> ahh, that is sweet, lets hug.

I can tell you have really thought this one out :-\

-TC

at 5/5/2009 6:16 AM

Oh, please...

Yep, this is what we need - another clique in the community. The question I have is, "if what you are interested in is Community, then why do you need to layer an artificial 'recognition' or 'reward' system on top of it?" It seems to me that perhaps Joel is upset about something and this is his way of fighting back.

Joel, rather than spending so much time being a divisive or polarizing force in the community, why don't you spend your time actually helping? (And, no, speaking at conferences isn't really "helping"). A true interest in 'Helping' is doing so for the sake of it - not because you get some type of reward or recognition. Some people can find it in themselves to do this without getting their name in lights - and those are the people who are in for the long haul - not a flash in the pan.

Goodbye, Joel. Your 15 minutes are just about up...

at 5/5/2009 6:31 AM

This isn't a bad idea, it is a good idea. Stop resisting people.

Hey Joel, I began reading the comments here and was surprised at everyone and a bit sad by the reaction. Here are my thoughts on this and I really hope that these upset people will read them and understand what I am trying to say. This is a wonderful idea. There is nothing, absolutely nothing BAD about this idea that I can see and honestly defend. Any group, or organization which promotes community contribution is a GOOD thing. The MVP program is a GOOD thing, in fact it is a great thing. The SharePoint Knights program is a GOOD thing. Any other program that is similar is a GOOD thing. The reason when it comes down to it is very simple. Anything which awards and thereby promotes contribution and effort of building the community does just that. It strengthens and builds the community. The point here is that people in the community want more rewards and motivation to get more people interested in helping out, and to help them stay motivated and interested in helping out. I really hope everyone can take a step back and appreciate that Joel is trying to help evangelize this great new idea and that he is not trying to harm the MVP image, or create rifts. Thank you, Richard Harbridge P.S - Personally Joel, I would have levels to this such as a SharePoint Squire, SharePoint Knight, SharePoint GrandMaster etc. You know cause that just seems cooler and has a bit more flexibility as a model.

at 5/5/2009 6:46 AM

I know a SPKnight when I see one

I don't care what title a person carries, MVP or otherwise. When a professional treats me (a female) with professionalism, shares their knowledge in a meaningful way, they become a knight whether anyone knows it or not.

For all the SPKnights that I worked with this past weekend at SPSDC, I salute you.

Fair maiden Deanna

at 5/5/2009 7:27 AM

U shoulda registered sharepointknights.com before writing this...

http://www.sharepointknights.com

Not funny yet? Wait for DNS changes to propagate.

at 5/5/2009 9:27 AM

Recognition is a great idea.

The job of a SharePoint Admin/Architect/Dev is often a thankless one, so I'm all for any rewards program that recognizes good effort.

-Karl

at 5/5/2009 10:52 AM

Thanks Joel For Recognizing us

Hey Joel,

Being in Sharepoint since 2003, ive been through all the beta's of MOSS/WSS 3.0 and worked through the products up's and downs and probably have come close to about 150 implementations. Ive contributed to codeplex with webparts and features and run my blog for 2 years now, blogging every little tweak or solution i come up with. Ive know a few that are MVP's but i never seem to be able to crack it, i think more because i lack the time solve issues on the Technet forums.

I think MVP's are great, and ive aspired to be one for a really long time now. I think their contribution is great to the community... but theres nothing wrong with a bit of competition.

So joel, after following your blog for years, keeping up with you and all the MVP's tweets and bloggings, i want to ask:

Where do i sign up? i want to take my Sharepoint job and life to the next level, and think this may be the way! it takes evangelists like yourself who many admire and aspire to emulate, to spark something fresh and new which helps the whole community grow.

So where DO i sign up?

at 5/5/2009 4:42 PM

Thanks Joel For Recognizing us

Hey Joel,

I think MVP's are great, and ive aspired to be one for a really long time now. I think their contribution is great to the community... but theres nothing wrong with a bit of competition.

So joel, after following your blog for years, keeping up with you and all the MVP's tweets and bloggings, i want to ask:

So where DO i sign up?

at 5/5/2009 9:12 PM

Ted Pattison - The soft-spoken SharePoint MVP

Yesterday, I read your first blog post and its comments. Today, the news that your next post compared itself to a religious manifesto from medieval times spread around my online world faster than swine flu coverage on CNN. I have spent the last few hours reading private DL threads that discuss public newsgroup threads that discuss your post and it comments. With all this extraneous noise I am wondering what you are really proposing here. Where's the meat?

As I read through everything, I sense that you are proposing to start up some type of body or organization that administrates granting knighthood and connecting knights with user groups and other communities. Are you the one who is going to spearhead this effort? From experience I know this will take a good deal of time and commitment on your part. Furthermore, some of this work will need to be done during regular business hours. It seems like the only way you could pull this off would be to get the approval of your employer, Quest. Yet this scenario would require that Quest willingly elects to support an organization that vows not to be controlled by the business interests of any company including Quest. This makes me wonder if your idea has any chance of going somewhere. Are there any more details you can shed to transform the SPKighthood program from fantasy to fiction?

One more thing I cannot resist. I am a life-long Monty Python fan so I really like the Knights metaphor. Although it's hard for me to take it seriously because I keep hearing all the quotes and sound bites from Monty Python and the Holy Grail running though my head. A final piece of advice from an old dude. If you choose to continue and build out this Knights metaphor in future posts, I strongly recommend against using the word "crusade". The word has a tendency to stir up unneeded controversy which I am sure you would want to avoid. You might remember that George Bush messed up on that one and we should all try and learn from his mistakes.

at 5/5/2009 9:14 PM

This was disappointing behavior...

U shoulda registered sharepointknights.com before writing this...

Not funny yet? Wait for DNS changes to propagate.

Registrant:
Bil Simser

Registered through: GoDaddy.com, Inc. (http://www.godaddy.com)
Domain Name: SHAREPOINTKNIGHTS.COM

at 5/5/2009 11:03 PM

SharePoint Joel's SharePoint Land

5/4/2009

Comments

I have seen your work...

SharePoint MVP - can of worms

A fellow knight

Interesting idea

You must be freaking kidding me

Got a point

You Rock

erm, why points for certification?

Interesting Idea

The Jedi Knights

SharePointJoel, aka SharePointJoke

Oh, please...

This isn't a bad idea, it is a good idea. Stop resisting people.

I know a SPKnight when I see one

U shoulda registered sharepointknights.com before writing this...

Recognition is a great idea.

Thanks Joel For Recognizing us

Thanks Joel For Recognizing us

Ted Pattison - The soft-spoken SharePoint MVP

This was disappointing behavior...

U shoulda registered sharepointknights.com before writing this...

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